Thank goodness for hybrid touch
Printed From: Avidyne
Category: Avidyne General
Forum Name: IFD 5 Series & IFD 4 Series Touch Screen GPS/NAV/COM
Forum Description: Topics on Avidyne's IFD 5 Series and IFD 4 Series Touch Screen GPS/NAV/COM
URL: http://forums.avidyne.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=244
Printed Date: 11 May 2025 at 5:17pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Thank goodness for hybrid touch
Posted By: AviJake
Subject: Thank goodness for hybrid touch
Date Posted: 12 Dec 2012 at 7:28pm
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I have spent a lot of time recently flight testing the IFD540 in one of our company aircraft. It is also equipped with a Garmin GTN750 (and a Garmin 530W). In even very mild bumpy air, an all-touch device is notably difficult to use. In real bumps, it's virtually impossible. I find that the typical bumpy air is up/down or vertical as opposed to left/right or lateral motion. The finger ledges along the left/right edges of the GTN are useless for me in counteracting that type of bumpy air. On the other hand, the IFD540 uses what we call "hybrid touch" meaning that virtually everything (map panning is the only real exception) can be done either via touch OR via bezel knobs and buttons. Thank goodness for that. When I try using just exclusively touch, I find it maddenly frustrating. The chances of touching what I actually want is just pure luck (and poor luck at that). Having a knob to grab onto or a dedicated bezel button has been a savior and in my mind, completely reinforces the "essential" status or need for those controls. All of that was really to be expected by anyone who flies even a little. What I hadn't anticipated was that in those bumpy conditions, you can inadvertently touch the glass when you are trying to actuate the knobs and buttons. Sometimes, you don't even know what you touched and it takes some effort to figure out or "undo" what you might have just done. For that challenge, I'm really glad that we have a top level control that allows the pilot to turn off touch and use strictly the bezel controls. Because we put it at the top level, it's simple to get to via the bezel controls and I find that it has become my primary technique as soon as I get into real bumpy air and then I turn touch back on when I've gotten back to smooth air. ------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Replies:
Posted By: oskrypuch
Date Posted: 13 Dec 2012 at 9:24am
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Not sure I agree. You had better send me one of those 540's, and let me see first hand! ;-) * Orest (semi-impatiently waiting) |
Posted By: Paul
Date Posted: 15 Dec 2012 at 7:02pm
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This means anything that you could want to change during bumpy conditions must be accessible through the buttons. I hope the interface allows that. As penance for making us all drool, how about if you post a photo of that panel with three GPS units? |
Posted By: brou0040
Date Posted: 15 Dec 2012 at 8:33pm
Agree!
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Paul wrote:Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 16 Dec 2012 at 3:37pm
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I will post photos of the panel BUT.....it'll have to wait another week or two. I just put the airplane back into the shop to get even more 3rd party avionics installed to serve as a flying integration validation test bed. When this is done, we'll have a ridiculous airplane - approx $200K of avionics housed in an airframe worth about $10K. The pictures will be fun. ------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: oskrypuch
Date Posted: 16 Dec 2012 at 4:35pm
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Wow, do you have to offload fuel, to carry $200k of avionics! * Orest |
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 16 Dec 2012 at 5:58pm
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I was too careless in my typing. $200K was meant to be $100K but that still gobs of stuff.
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: Paul
Date Posted: 08 Jan 2013 at 3:06pm
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Is the plane out of the shop? How about a photo tour? |
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 08 Jan 2013 at 3:20pm
Not out yet. It's due out this coming Friday (11 Jan). Will post pix when in possession. Just to give you a sense of the work being done to it:
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: Leonard
Date Posted: 08 Jan 2013 at 3:43pm
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S.J. Looks (Reads) like with all the avionics you could use a avionics safety pilot! SG
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Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 08 Jan 2013 at 5:39pm
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You bet - do you want 2nd or 3rd shift? And just because I'm feeling a little cocky right now, it's fun to note the airplane already had:
which are all staying in there. ------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: Gring
Date Posted: 08 Jan 2013 at 10:06pm
| No engine monitor? |
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 08 Jan 2013 at 10:12pm
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No. For the first part, there isn't a spare inch of panel space left. But the real reason is that we're using the plane as an IFD540 test bed and are really just concerned about gear that the IFD540 connects with. There is no significant connection between the IFd540 and any engine monitor. ------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: Gring
Date Posted: 08 Jan 2013 at 10:21pm
| Was thinking about something like a JPI with FF info to send FF data and receive GPS info for computing fuel required to next way pt, etc. Or does the JPI and Shaden share the same data format? I use the fuel planning page on the 430 when flying max distance flights. |
Posted By: Leonard
Date Posted: 08 Jan 2013 at 10:28pm
| MY luck I'll get the part at the end of the fuel nozzel and dip stick!! AND be too good at it to be replaced! |
Posted By: Paul
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2013 at 4:55pm
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This $10K airplane can support a DFC-90? What is it? And what is the BK229 RMI for? I think my wife will volunteer to be second shift safety pilot. |
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 09 Jan 2013 at 5:17pm
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Cessna 182. The RMI is typical in a lot of the installations the IFD540 is already destined to go in. It turns out it's not a straight-forward interface so we wanted to test it in real flight environments. ------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: Paul
Date Posted: 23 Jan 2013 at 10:35am
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So about those photos... If you're willing I could meet you for lunch at 6B6 one day when the restaurant is open - I'll take the photos and post them. Or you could fly it over after work (or we could drive to BED) and give my wife the opportunity to log safety pilot time. |
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 23 Jan 2013 at 12:43pm
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Serves me right for being so cocky about it a few week ago - plane is STILL in the shop. Putting power onto it today and hoping for the best..... I'll still post the pix when I get my hands on the airplane. As for the ride and show and tell, I would love to but we're under strict self-enforced orders to keep this thing under wraps until it's in the certification chute with the FAA. It's killing me but I'm going to stay disciplined on that one. ------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: oskrypuch
Date Posted: 23 Jan 2013 at 1:30pm
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We feel your pain. ;-) * Orest |
Posted By: tony
Date Posted: 23 Jan 2013 at 6:37pm
Steve, just a safety tip....if you let the smoke out of the electronic components, they wont work anymore. Please dont let the smoke out.
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Posted By: Paul
Date Posted: 24 Jan 2013 at 9:56pm
| And I was going to ask you for a recommendation for where to get my IFD-540 installed when it arrives... |
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 25 Jan 2013 at 8:57am
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We use NexAir Avionics in Mansfield MA for all our company airplane mods done in the Northeast as well as just about every R9 installation in the nation. We hold them in very high regard. ------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: Paul
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2013 at 10:56am
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NexAir is one of the companies on my list to check when I get the new GPS. As far as the plane, this just sounds like another case of "Everything takes longer than you think". I'm just hoping the nitwits in government don't manage to shut down the FAA before the IFD540 finishes certification. |
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 02 Feb 2013 at 7:53am
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Got the test airplane back late Friday night. It's awesome. It was too dark to take any good pictures but I'll take and post some early next week. The avionics geeks of the world are going to salivate. ------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: Paul
Date Posted: 19 Feb 2013 at 10:14am
| Photos? |
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 23 Feb 2013 at 9:45am
   
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |
Posted By: oskrypuch
Date Posted: 23 Feb 2013 at 12:03pm
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{disregard}
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Posted By: phkmn
Date Posted: 23 Feb 2013 at 7:30pm
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Thanks for the pix. You need a bigger panel, something like a Tbone :-)
------------- PH |
Posted By: oskrypuch
Date Posted: 23 Feb 2013 at 8:10pm
I got a spot for it! Please! * Orest |
Posted By: MysticCobra
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2013 at 11:00am
| Whoops--someone busted one of the buttons off your 540 (upper left bezel). Hope they got a stern talking-to! :) |
Posted By: oskrypuch
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2013 at 12:48pm
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For sure! Ha, old marketing pics I guess. I would be delighted to take an up-to-date pic myself!
* Orest |
Posted By: Paul
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2013 at 7:08pm
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Steve, thanks for the photos. That's quite the panel! I don't think that is a missing button. That unit is clearly a prototype (see the labels stuck on the right side above the buttons). Originally Avidyne was going to use some sort of SD card to update data but they changed it to a USB stick. The hole on the upper right looks like a USB port - my guess is that one was added there. There also appears to be an engine monitor. Steve said there wasn't one but the indicator on the lower left of the panel sure looks like one. Maybe they added it when he wasn't looking, or maybe it isn't connected to any of the Avidyne gear so it doesn't count. Is that an annunciator below the throttle? |
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2013 at 7:25pm
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I should have known these shots would have analyzed closer than nextgen Chinese "fighters". Yes, that's an annunciator panel below the throttle quadrant (we have the luxury of not having to worry about proper cockpit placement of this stuff) and yes, that is a USB port on the bezel of the IFD540. The obnoxious white buttons on the IFD540 is just because that's an early prototype that I slide into the airplane. On any given day, I put the IFD540 in the top slot and the 530 in the bottom slot or vice versa. I fly now with IFD540s in both slots too. There are engine monitors in the panel but none on the IFD540 I'm afraid. ------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com |